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 Hello from the UK

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Super12v
Skogenracing Small
Super12v

Antal inlägg : 23
Age : 40
Namn : Rob T.
Från : United Kingdom
Kör : 2.9 XR4x4
Registration date : 09-03-13

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimefre 13 mar 2009, 14:16

Hi,

I'm new to your forums. I'm from the UK so I hope I am welcome.

I have a XR4x4 which I have supercharged using a Eaton M90. I am thinking of possibly adding a single turbo to the setup..... maybe!

A few pictures.

Hello from the UK DSCN4978

Hello from the UK Brandssiggy

Hello from the UK DSCN4961

Regards

Rob
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Henka_
Skogenracing Elite
Henka_

Antal inlägg : 1915
Age : 30
Namn : Henke
Från : Geffle
Kör : SxxB
Registration date : 07-02-20

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimefre 13 mar 2009, 14:20

That is a very nice car! Welcome to skogenracing.
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Rekord E2 Turbo
Skogenracing Extreme
Rekord E2 Turbo

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InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimefre 13 mar 2009, 14:25

Nice!! More pic´s on that one!!

Perhaps a movie??
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Super12v
Skogenracing Small
Super12v

Antal inlägg : 23
Age : 40
Namn : Rob T.
Från : United Kingdom
Kör : 2.9 XR4x4
Registration date : 09-03-13

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimefre 13 mar 2009, 14:31

Not many video's I'm afraid.

I have this one when I first started the new engine. I have another but I'll have to upload that.

http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=6538192628139402454

Thankyou for the kind comments.
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Super12v
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Super12v

Antal inlägg : 23
Age : 40
Namn : Rob T.
Från : United Kingdom
Kör : 2.9 XR4x4
Registration date : 09-03-13

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimefre 13 mar 2009, 15:35

How it all started in the winter months of 2002. Yes it has been a long project! And now everything is running pretty sweet, I want to ruin it all by adding a Turbo! let the development start again!

Hello from the UK Img3e8aff7868fc1-1

Video has just finished uploading

http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=4426322107995773134


Senast ändrad av Super12v den fre 13 mar 2009, 17:29, ändrad totalt 1 gång
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zorbit
Skogenracing Supreme
zorbit

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Registration date : 06-10-14

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimefre 13 mar 2009, 17:13

Cool car! bad ass engine! Hello from the UK Av-26
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Mikael
Skogencrew
Mikael

Antal inlägg : 15246
Age : 39
Namn : Mikael
Från : Gävle
Kör : Subaru Impreza WRX STi, Skidoo summit tjejskoter
Registration date : 06-10-11

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimefre 13 mar 2009, 18:52

Nice Smile Whats the setup? Engine management system, the engine and so on?

_________________
“I live my life a quarter mile at a time. For those ten seconds or less I'm free nothing else matter”
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werd
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werd

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Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimefre 13 mar 2009, 19:18

Really nice car and setup!
And nice "shed" your working in Wink
More pics please Smile
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Super12v
Skogenracing Small
Super12v

Antal inlägg : 23
Age : 40
Namn : Rob T.
Från : United Kingdom
Kör : 2.9 XR4x4
Registration date : 09-03-13

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimefre 13 mar 2009, 21:29

Hi Mikael, it was your 2.9's that have brought me to this site. I really really want to work on a compound setup and I know very little about speccing turbo's and came across your's. That GT40 can power surely much more than you currently have? I currently run 10psi from this blower, and I don't have much choise to increase boost with out draining too much power from the crank and also creating alot more heat. So the coolest way I can think of to get 1bar+ is with a Turbo affraid but I know it will bring a whole new head ache to get it running nicely with the supercharger. My thoughts at the moment is to feed the blower with a turbo setup pretty much identical to yours, and I was going to start with a turbo first and build around that, but most likely a internally gated turbo which will not be on it limit at 20psi. I was think a Cosworth T4 but they'e quite expensive so looking for options as this will be done on a budget.

Hi werd, yeah all work out of my little shed Smile What sort of pictures? the shell to be fair is generally tired and needs some attention. I have lots of boring assembly pictures and some while I was making the kit.

Spec from memory (prolly missing bits)

Engine:
+1mm over bore using Accralite forged pistons ~7.5:1 cr
24v crank
lightened fly and crank pulley Shocked
AP racing Organic clutch
Piper 270 cam with reduced overlap
Eaton M90 Supercharger running at 2.26:1 ratio
Modified US spec bronco plenum
Stage 3 Heads : enlarged inlet and exhaust valve, flowed, bronze guides
Modified Pulsar GTI-r intercooler
MBE941 ECU with wasted spark setup
24v coil pack & 10mm HT lead's
Platinum plugs 0.9mm gap
350cc high impedance injectors (from Lotus Carlton)
12.9 Head bolts with S/S machined washers made

Current fuel setup:
Intank Walbro 255lph pump, standard lines and early style steel rail.

New fuel setup:
This will be upgraded soon with -6 fuel lines with 180lph intank lift pump feeding 1.5litre swirl port and walbro 255lph external pump feeding modfied steel rail with -6 fittings.

Suspension:
Car is fully polybushed including rear diff mount.
AVO coilovers all round with adjustable platforms.

Brakes:
Standard rear - Non vented rea disc's
Front - 300mm ST170 disc's with Wilwood billet 4 pots

Transmission:
Standard MT75 4x4 with 3.62:1 final drive

I datalog from my ECU and also have a Zietronix ZT-2 with EGT, RPM, TPS, AFR logging.

Regards

Rob


Senast ändrad av Super12v den fre 13 mar 2009, 22:06, ändrad totalt 2 gånger
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Henka_
Skogenracing Elite
Henka_

Antal inlägg : 1915
Age : 30
Namn : Henke
Från : Geffle
Kör : SxxB
Registration date : 07-02-20

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimefre 13 mar 2009, 21:39

That is a very nice list, but isn´t the carlton injectors bigger then that? i thought atleast 465cc.

Edit, Mikael has a 2.8 or two acctually Smile if im not out riding a bike.
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Mikael
Skogencrew
Mikael

Antal inlägg : 15246
Age : 39
Namn : Mikael
Från : Gävle
Kör : Subaru Impreza WRX STi, Skidoo summit tjejskoter
Registration date : 06-10-11

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimefre 13 mar 2009, 21:47

Sell the supercharger and go for one big turbo insteed. With that engine modification you will easely manage well over 400hk at 1bar of boost, reduced overlapp is for engines with tiny turbos but will work fine anyway.
My GT40 that i use give full boost somewhere around 3500-4000rpm, it manages 550hp so it´s a bit large, but the engine don´t work so hard at rpm that are sensitive. Thats why we can drive around with 1.3 bar in completely stock engines that haven´t even been opened.

1.1 bar gives with some good mapping 370hp and 550newton on a standard engine.

Do you have some time and speed from the strip (201m or 402m)?

Henka_: I Sold the sierra and it´s 2.9 not 2.8 Smile the old 2.8 is a really crappy engine, works best as an anchor to the boat Very Happy

_________________
“I live my life a quarter mile at a time. For those ten seconds or less I'm free nothing else matter”


Senast ändrad av Mikael den fre 13 mar 2009, 21:48, ändrad totalt 1 gång
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Super12v
Skogenracing Small
Super12v

Antal inlägg : 23
Age : 40
Namn : Rob T.
Från : United Kingdom
Kör : 2.9 XR4x4
Registration date : 09-03-13

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimefre 13 mar 2009, 21:47

Hi Henka, well I inherited them from a friend from his 2.9 Twin Turbo and I was assured they were 350cc and I've taken his word for that figure.

I run them at 3bar @atmos which hit about 80% max duration. I'll have a look, I will have them clean and flow tested after I've fitted the new fuel setup, so I'll know for sure. They will possibly need upgrading regardless as they're pretty much flowing to the max now.
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Henka_
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Henka_

Antal inlägg : 1915
Age : 30
Namn : Henke
Från : Geffle
Kör : SxxB
Registration date : 07-02-20

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimefre 13 mar 2009, 21:56

Im sorry rob, asked a friend now and he confirmed your info ( http://www.garaget.org/Lotus940 ) check out his cars Smile okej mikael im sorry, i remember now that you have said that about the boat anchor earlier Very Happy
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Super12v
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Super12v

Antal inlägg : 23
Age : 40
Namn : Rob T.
Från : United Kingdom
Kör : 2.9 XR4x4
Registration date : 09-03-13

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimefre 13 mar 2009, 21:58

I'm afraid I won't be selling the blower, love pulling away from you turbo boys too much Laughing . No seriously it's good to be different. However is does lack a little something, bit too linear delivery wise and it's awesome torque and instantly available but there no wind up, very eager and goes some but no buzz. RWD may suit it better... still undecided
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Mikael
Skogencrew
Mikael

Antal inlägg : 15246
Age : 39
Namn : Mikael
Från : Gävle
Kör : Subaru Impreza WRX STi, Skidoo summit tjejskoter
Registration date : 06-10-11

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimefre 13 mar 2009, 22:04

You havent meet the right turbocar then , luckely our cars i sweden have gearboxes Very Happy

Torque is actualy irrelevant it´s the horsepower thats mathers, with the supercharger you have much horspower at low revs.
I always wonder why many people think that it´s necesary to have full power from very lowrevs, look at a normaly aspirated engine with some real tuning, it´s often got no power at low revs but works fine anyway on the track

Look at my G-tech time with the sierra, do you se any turbolag? Cool

Hello from the UK Mikael_SierraV6turbo

_________________
“I live my life a quarter mile at a time. For those ten seconds or less I'm free nothing else matter”
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Super12v
Skogenracing Small
Super12v

Antal inlägg : 23
Age : 40
Namn : Rob T.
Från : United Kingdom
Kör : 2.9 XR4x4
Registration date : 09-03-13

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimefre 13 mar 2009, 22:21

Oh don't me wrong, once you've spooled you'll probably real me in, it's not a top end car, pulls in any gear at any speed. I still maintain a stock rev limit of 6,250.

Not sure if you noticed in that vid I dumped the clutch at around 4-5k I struggled to put the power down, I ended up sticking to dumping at 2k and I seemed to get away better.

Also I don't thikn the car is more the 300BHP, but I've never dyno'd the car either. however they is still some mapping to be done

It's was 201m I think, times I'm unaware of as the timing setup didn't work properly so they stopped using it.
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Super12v
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Super12v

Antal inlägg : 23
Age : 40
Namn : Rob T.
Från : United Kingdom
Kör : 2.9 XR4x4
Registration date : 09-03-13

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimefre 13 mar 2009, 22:27

Ah right, well I think you may be confused, this is still a comfortable road car for me. And the 3 factors when I built this was a/ to be different and b/ to have a very usable wide torque spread (idle to redline) c/ retain the feel of the XR4x4. All of which I beleive to have acheived. Yes I do like go on the track however this is a full interior, car and is usable and comfortable and always will be.
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Mikael
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Mikael

Antal inlägg : 15246
Age : 39
Namn : Mikael
Från : Gävle
Kör : Subaru Impreza WRX STi, Skidoo summit tjejskoter
Registration date : 06-10-11

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimefre 13 mar 2009, 22:41

Comfort is very important, i have full interior in my cars to. I know why you want supercharger, but i often try to convince everyone that i meet to follow the turbocharger way, it is the best of course. Different doesnt mean taking the right way all the time Smile

We always increase the the rev limiter to 6700-6800 to expand the power range, i am surprised that the cologne 2.9 v6 is so sustainable.

i havent found the limit yet Shocked

_________________
“I live my life a quarter mile at a time. For those ten seconds or less I'm free nothing else matter”
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Super12v
Skogenracing Small
Super12v

Antal inlägg : 23
Age : 40
Namn : Rob T.
Från : United Kingdom
Kör : 2.9 XR4x4
Registration date : 09-03-13

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimefre 13 mar 2009, 23:05

I do not see a right or wrong, I see a problem and a solution. But this maybe something lost in translation. Don't think I am anti-turbo as I am not, I think supercharger gets a rough time, especially good old roots, not as bad as many make out. Although I do believe blowers have more Kudos Hello from the UK Tihi

I'm surprised you're getting away with that, which spec block do you use? the later 95 Scorpio block which the same reinforcement as the 24v bob? I still run a pre UK cat block which is the weakest of all.

Commonly at sustained RPM arond 7k will flex the caps and the middle 2 caps will depart causing a nice mess in the process.

I have oversped to 6,750 before, I'm not sure the case of this yet or if it was a misreading. I've seen this happen once so far.

Also in the video, either my poor driving or crap gearbox I struggle to change gear quick enough as this engine loves the limiter on this engine , so differnet to the last, which was stock albiet the chambers were macine to lower the CR slightly. The lighter rotating assembly make this pick up so quickly.

I'm at work right now, so don't have access to any info, but I have a datalog in 4th gear from 800rpm to just shy of redline and it's the same time from 800 rpm to 3,500 rpm as it from 3,500rpm to 6000rpm. I forget the time exactly but 20 second total seems fimiliar.

By the way I just want to say.... all your english is perfect. Feel embarressed I ca only speak one language!
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Super12v
Skogenracing Small
Super12v

Antal inlägg : 23
Age : 40
Namn : Rob T.
Från : United Kingdom
Kör : 2.9 XR4x4
Registration date : 09-03-13

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimelör 14 mar 2009, 06:07

Here are a few more pictures. The White Sierra is a good friend of mine with a 24v fitted.

Hello from the UK IMG_1759-1

Hello from the UK PIC00108

Hello from the UK Carrollin

Body wise I have no real great plans other than try and bring the piant back up and treat rust area's (there's a few!) .

I have a full RS accessory kit (ie front, rear aprons plus side skirts), only the front apron is fitted for now and the rest will be added again at some point.
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Mikael
Skogencrew
Mikael

Antal inlägg : 15246
Age : 39
Namn : Mikael
Från : Gävle
Kör : Subaru Impreza WRX STi, Skidoo summit tjejskoter
Registration date : 06-10-11

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimelör 14 mar 2009, 10:41

I would have to say that all of you englishmen have really good taste in how a car should look like Hello from the UK Av-26 Some more movies filmed outside your car when you are driving around would be really nice!

Supercharger is cool, that i cant argue about Smile We have one here on this forum that are building a 4liter supercharged cologne with 24v heads.


Super12v skrev:

I'm surprised you're getting away with that, which spec block do you use? the later 95 Scorpio block which the same reinforcement as the 24v bob? I still run a pre UK cat block which is the weakest of all.

Commonly at sustained RPM arond 7k will flex the caps and the middle 2 caps will depart causing a nice mess in the process.

I have oversped to 6,750 before, I'm not sure the case of this yet or if it was a misreading. I've seen this happen once so far.

We use engines from 89-91, they are te most common here, with you engine modifications i sure you can rise the rev-limit to 6500-6600 at least, that way you don´t use the rev-limiter so much, and get more acceleration.

_________________
“I live my life a quarter mile at a time. For those ten seconds or less I'm free nothing else matter”
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Super12v
Skogenracing Small
Super12v

Antal inlägg : 23
Age : 40
Namn : Rob T.
Från : United Kingdom
Kör : 2.9 XR4x4
Registration date : 09-03-13

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimelör 14 mar 2009, 21:12

Well for now, i'm not sure what movies I have, not many from the outside, infact not many at all. So i'll come back to you.

I've got some datalog's here and I've done a few speed calc from them. So may help put the car into real terms.

I've got 2 runs from rolling, one in 4th until I bottle it and one rolling in 1st through to 5t h here the graphs and below that are my calcs in to speed.

Figures are based on 215/40/17 tyre not taking into account any tyre expansion. Also 3.62 final drive.

Hello from the UK Datalog-1

1st-5th gear pull

16-54 mph = 4 Seconds
54- 103 mph = 10 Seconds

4th gear pull

17-54 mph = 9 Seconds
54-103 mph = 10 Seconds
103-117 mph = 2 Seconds

Looking at them like that they don't look overly great ! however I know there still some work left in the map so we'll see what can be improved.
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Super12v
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Super12v

Antal inlägg : 23
Age : 40
Namn : Rob T.
Från : United Kingdom
Kör : 2.9 XR4x4
Registration date : 09-03-13

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimelör 14 mar 2009, 21:20

Just realised you will want metric Smile

1st-5th gear pull

25.4-86.4 kph= 4 Seconds
86.4- 164.8 kph = 10 Seconds

4th gear pull

27.2-86.4 kph = 9 Seconds
86.4-164.8 kph = 10 Seconds
164.8-187.2 kph = 2 Seconds

Just realise ignore the figure "164.8-187.2 kph = 2 Seconds" as that speed is false as I can see that is where I depressed the clutch. The rest should be ok upto 164 kph.
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Mikael
Skogencrew
Mikael

Antal inlägg : 15246
Age : 39
Namn : Mikael
Från : Gävle
Kör : Subaru Impreza WRX STi, Skidoo summit tjejskoter
Registration date : 06-10-11

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimelör 14 mar 2009, 21:43

Can you pick out even numbers? 50-100, 50-150 and so on?

_________________
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Super12v
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Super12v

Antal inlägg : 23
Age : 40
Namn : Rob T.
Från : United Kingdom
Kör : 2.9 XR4x4
Registration date : 09-03-13

Hello from the UK Empty
InläggRubrik: Sv: Hello from the UK   Hello from the UK Icon_minitimelör 14 mar 2009, 21:47

I can do, give me a few moments.... Smile
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